1500 Orcs & Goblins v 1500 Lizardmen

Have I mentioned lately how much I love 8th edition? Never feel like I am beaten before game starts, never feel I have game won before game starts...to read just the game section, skip to after the row of asterisks.

Anyway, tried to get together High Elf list but it came down to choice between Dragon Mage or Prince on Griffon...so I made the obvious choice of O&G.

I love starting with Gorbad. He is okay in close combat but where he really shines is letting me have an army of S4 multiple attack guys...and S5 on the first turn of combat.

Gorbad filled my Lord points, I took a level 2 night goblin with Dispel Scroll, 20 Savage Orc Big 'Uns with extra hand weapon & full command (& Big Stabbas), 10 Savage Orc Boar riders w/extra hand weapon & full command, and 20 Night Goblins w/2 fanatics, Arachnarok Spider and a Mangler Squig. 1500 points on the nose. I would have a commanding, nigh un-overcomable 1 point advantage as Fullur could merely manage 1499 points.

I like putting the 10 boar riders with Gorbad. If they pass animosity they get in combat lightning quick. If they fail animosity they get into combat ever faster with potentially 25 S5 or 6 attacks without taking into account the 6 more Boar attacks. I like my odds of dealing out some damage.

Meanwhile the 20 strong Savage Orcs are a nasty unit in their own right. The Night goblins with short bows were a nuisance unit meant to whittle down the enemy and throw a few fanatics at them while the Mangler would control a flank with his potential for massive damage.

Meanwhile Deathnarok is a fast, potentially very hard hitting unit that will get where I need it when I need it.

The result is a compact, mobile, tough, hard hitting army (sounds a lot like my Warriors of Chaos, except less well armored. Ironically I have a much better save percentage with these guys...)

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We rolled up Blood and Glory. Strong. With 3 banners and Gorbad I have Fortitude 5. A Khemrian Marsh and mysterious river bifurcated the field right in the middle, a couple mysterious forests further made it a mystical, anti-maneuverable field.

Unless I put the Mangler on the left with a clear shot, the Boar Riders next to him to crest the hill, the Deathnarok where he could cross the river in one turn. The Night Goblin bowmen held the center of the field and the foot Savage Orcs protected the right flank from his Cold One riders.

He centered his army around several swarms with a large block of Skinks/Kroxigor on my left flank, a bastilidon behind the swarms, a big block of saurus behind the forest and his cold ones on my right flank.

O&G Turn 1
I did a general advance. My 20 strong bowmen could not fire, the Deathnarok riders hit just once and he saved it. I got poison on my foot Savage orcs.

Lizardmen Turn 1
His Cold ones don't move. In fact, let me save time: they never move until I charge them in turn 4. Everything else makes a measured advance. He moves his Saurus into the forest and I realize what a huge mistake I made. He forces the Fanatics into the open.

I can't send them after the Saurus...the forest would kill them. I have to launch them towards his Cold Ones on the right...which effectively takes my Savage Orcs out of the battle unless I want to change taking a massive hit.

Anyway, I have to let the Amber Spear hit Deathnarok, but it fails to wound. His shooting is better, wounding the Mangler twice. Ouch.

O&G Turn 2
I declare a double charge on the Skinks/Krox with my Boar Riders and Deathnarok.I am hoping the Mangler hits them and bounces out of my way first. Meanwhile I get my Night Goblins close enough to shoot at the Cold Ones.

Time to save time: I get off 56 shots with them in this game. I get 1 wound, which he saves. For the remainder of the game this unit fires ineffectually while the shaman goes nuts.

My charge hits home with both units but he stand and shoots down 3 of my Savage Orcs. Ouch. 30% gone already?

I get Bad Moon off and ship the vortex through his Saurus and Swarms. I forget it is a template and have him take just 6 tests. He loses 1 Saurus. Oops, my bad.

Meanwhile, Gorbad is in a challenge with a skink unit champ. I am licking my chops at the overkill. Except I only wound him 1 time. Oops. Warpaint is amazing, though, and I save both wounds his skinks put on me. Deathnarok kills 4 skinks, the Night Goblins on top do 5 wounds (hmm...), my Savage Orcs wound the Krox 5 times,kill off 3 more skinks...he flees, I run him down...and run into the Mangler. Between what he did to me and what I do to myself with the Mangler, I am down to Gorbad and the command models. I have lost 6 of that unit already...this is not good because my 20 man block is locked away on the right wing and the Deathnarok clipped the Swarms in his overrun.

Lizardman 2
His Saurus move to flank the Deathnarok next turn. He dispels Bad Moon, uses the shooting thing from the Bastilidon to put a wound or two on Deathnarok, I can only wound his hero once, the Night Goblins only do 1 wound, his SWARMS do 2 to Deathnarok...only a Thunderstomp lets me win. Well, that and the charge. But his anti-squishy ability saves the crumble. And he then adds a Swarm with the special rule...so they are STRONGER than they were before I attacked. This is not good...

O&G Turn 3
I spin the Boar riders to face the bastilidon, one Fanatic caroms into the forest, I fail to restrain and my Savage Orc block fails their charge, moving just 4 or 5". I finish off his hero, do lots of wounds, but so does he...Deathnarok takes 4 more wounds. I am down to just 2 wounds.

Lizardmen Turn 3
His Saurus flank charge the Deathnarok. The Bastilidon does another shooting wound. He adds another Swarm.

 Deathnarok will not go quietly, doing 4 wounds to the swarms and the Night Goblins do another, but his Saurus do 7 wounds to Arachnarok...who only had 1 left. Down goes Deathnarok as usual.

O&G Turn 4
The Savage Orcs fail to meet their charge distance. The Boar Boys charge the Bastilidon. Bad Moon succeeds, I do two wounds to the Swarms and kill a couple Saurus.

Gorbad hits the Bastilidon twice, both wound...and both multiply to 3 wounds, 1-shotting the poor Bastilidon. I clip the swarms on the overrun.

Lizardmen Turn 4
He flips the Saurus to face the nigh inevitable Savage Orc Boar Boy charge.
Gorbad, who remember does multiple wounds, has 4 attacks needing 3 to hit, 2 to wound, does...2 wounds to the swarms.But the Savage Orcs make up for it, doing 6 and the Boars do a couple more. Finally those obnoxious, lethal swarms (who ever thought I would say THAT?) are gone, gone, gone. Yeah! They go to crumble, so no overrun.

O&G Turn 5
I quickly check. He has 2 banners left. I just need to get one more. Unfortunately, I don't think the 3 remaining Savage Orc boar boys and the underwhelming Gorbad can take on 25ish Saurus. If he beats me in that combat I lose because I will only have 1 Fortitude. Oh, well, we are Orcs. The 20 man block charges the Cold One Knights, I charge his Saurus block. Death or Glory, right?

I get the Poison on the 20 man Savage Orc block with irresistible, do a wound to myself and lose rest of my power dice.

First I do the Savage Orcs on foot v Cold Ones. Our unit champs fight a challenge. I whiff all 4 attacks. His champ misses 2 of the 3 and cannot wound with the 4th. His Cold one hits once, cannot wound. That was...unimpressive.

But my rank & file do me proud, doing 11 wounds and he only saves 1, kills back 2 or 3 Savage Orcs and is run down.

Back to the important battle: if he wins it he wins the game, if we draw or I win it, his army will "break".

My Champ and his champ get in a challenge. Gorbad continues to prove outside of the Bastilidon, he just doesn't have a lot of combat power, doing just 1 wound. My unit champ does better, doing 2 wounds and saving the only wound done to him. (Go go gadget Warpaint!)

Gnarla matches Gorbad's output, the standard bearer does a couple more. He cannot wound Gorbad, does kill the standard bearer. I win the combat...and run him down. He was tabled.

What Went Right
The combo charge was a thing of beauty. He never had a chance. I had so many attacks that even a sub-par outcome was still a devastating win. Gorbad one-shotting the Bastilidon was awesome and, words you have never heard before and will probably never hear again, I DOMINATED the magic phase, getting off Gift of the Spider I think 3 times and Bad Moon twice.

Also, I saved like a fiend. Needing 5's and 6's to save I probably saved 30-40% of the wounds he did.

What Went Wrong
Bad setup of the Night goblins meant my Fanatics held up a powerful unit and did NOTHING to him.
My bowfire was...ineffective.
Dominating the magic phase killed 5 Saurus and 1 Swarm wound...not really a big deal.
Mangler did 3 hits to him...and 3 to me. That hurt me worse.


Overall it was a really fun game. Would have preferred a slightly different outcome, like...NOT tabling him, but I really like the new Lizard book and had a great time.

1500 pt O&G v. High Elfs

I ponder how to set up my mighty forces, feeling mighty spiffy in my rocking pink collar.
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As with much of the Warhammer universe, our group takes a dim view of the abilities of the Orc and Goblin army. There is a reason for this.

On any given turn, on average close to 1/3rd of your army will be operating outside your complete control due to animosity/Waaaagggh non-sense. This is compounded by low leadership and sub-par strength of attacks.

The result is a hard to control army subject to fleeing at inopportune times and struggling to wound tough enemies.

On the flip side of the coin, they have some very fun stuff. I played a game (no report written) a couple weaks ago at 1000 points versus the Beastmen. I had a jolly good time with the Doom Diver, the Iron-Back Boar impact hits, the Squig Hoppers, and the Fanatics. In fact, the Squig Hoppers saw off one unit on turn two and, when defeated in turn three, led their pursuers too close to the Night Goblins, thus seeing the Fanatics whirl in and finish him off (they took out his best unit which included his general and another key character so we packed it in after I think 2 turns since the game was, for all intents and purposes, over) (thus the lack of report...short game.)

My buddy Space Monkey and I decided on the spur of the moment to play a game to get him some experience with the High Elfs. He has his dragon painted and a couple other units that, combined with some stuff I had painted would make for a small but intriguing game.


He wanted to use his Dragon Mage, so off we went.

Contrary to my usual practice, I elected to build a thematic army. Generally, I just build an army by first putting in the units I want to play, then using my remaining points to cover the weaknesses.

This time I chose to emphasize the "no control" theme; all Savage Orcs or Night Goblins.*

In the set-up, I then further went with the theme. The Night Goblins...who universally fear the elfs would be on the right flank. I put 20 bows spread in a thin line anchored on the forest on the hill on my extreme right, with the Spear Chukkah in the forest. The other Spear Chukkah was on my left, and the Night Goblin Spearmen went behind the bowmen. Then the Squig Hoppers went on the extreme right in the forest, their ability to skirmish meaning it would not matter.


On the left I went similar...in front were 13 Savage Orc Bowmen, with 15 Savage Orc Big Uns with extra Choppa in hand, and the Shaman, Big Boss on Ironback Boar and Chariot behind them. The Giant was more or less just between the spear chukkah and the Night Goblins.


He placed a line of Lothern Sea Guard spread in a line facing my Night Goblin bowmen, and behind them his White Lions and Phoenix Guard?

In his hill-top forest went his Repeater Bolt Thrower and Shadow Warriors with his Knights just next to the forest and in front of his Dragon mage.


O&G Turn 1I fail my animosity with the Night Goblin Spearmen (actually, I Waaaghed...but I needed them to NOT move for my battle plan/army theme so I consider it a fail), and make a general advance to get in range. I should have had him go first...*sigh* oh well. I then get the Foot of Gork off with Irresistible force and kill 3 Knights. 1 Spear Chukkah manages to wound the dragon...a great start for the greenskins!



High Elf Turn 1
On my left flank, he moves his Swordmasters forward and runs the Knights forward in front of them. He elects not to move anything on my right flank, though the Dragon Mage does fly off to my extreme right.

He then costs Conflagration of Doom on my Giant with a whopping 16 or so, and I am forced to use my only Dispel Scroll on it.

His Repeater Bolt thrower then fires a spread at my Savage Orc Arrer Boyz, wounding 2, one of which my mighty Warpaint saves.

This is one of those moments that is great about the game.

I, personally, prefer to use RBT to take out tough targets. I would have gone after the Giant. Yet I have seen some pretty solid statistical analysis that indicates the most damage is done by firing it the way he did.

My theory, however, goes thusly. A giant is tough to kill...high T, many W. He only has one or two things likely to have good chances to wound me. a RBT is one of those.

It is interesting to note that I am in the distinct minority even in the Starving Crazed Weasels...most prefer not to shoot when they have but one chance to hit.

I can certainly understand that point of view and do not necessarily disagree with it...however, he had Knights, Swordmasters, White Lions and Phoenix Guard who could all reasonably be expected to wound the Arrer Boyz relatively frequently, but is only a FAVORITE to wound the Giant with the Dragon and RBT. Their higher S (and the RBT ability to multi-wound) mean they are a threat the Giant must respect.

Meanwhile, the Giant was the only VISIBLE thing I had with a reasonable chance to wound his Dragon. If I lose the Giant, his Dragon could conceivably rampage at will throughout my lines. I had nothing else to stop it. Thus, to me, the clear target is taking out the only threat to your dominant advantage.

It all comes down to play style and choices.

I USUALLY go after the most dangerous thing first and then clean up the rest at my leisure. I also realize it is personal preference, and there is no really "wrong" answer here. Both methods have advantages and disadvantages.

His Shadow Warrios also fire at the Arrer Boyz and kill another. His Lothern Seaguard rain 3 hits on the Squig Hoppers, but their S3 proves unable to wound.






O & G Turn 2The Arrer Boyz really have no interest in charging, but my General, being frenzied, is GOING to charge whether I want him to or not...so they might as well to provide him some support. And there are just two knights... so in go the Arrer Boyz.

On the right flank, I demonstrate a complete incompetence in regard to the rules. I think his reckless rule functions like frenzy and that if a flyer flies into trees, it is destroyed like impassable terrain.

So I move my Squig Hoppers towards his dragon mage to force that exact scenario.
I was wrong on every count. He is NOT forced to charge and would stop just short of the trees. Oops.

I manage to get all my magic dispelled, the one that hurt being rolling double 3s, he having just one die left and rolling a six. Grrr.

Shooting not much better as one Spear Chukkah hits, but a "1" means no wounds.

The General does 3 impact hits (Iron Back Boar, but he saves 2 of them, then in the challenge I whiff. Fortunately, I outnumber, and win...they break, I over-run. The Arrer Boyz barely move, but the General over-runs into the RBT. Woo-hoo!

High Elf Turn 2His Phoenix Guard charge the Arrer Boyz, his Dragon mage charges the Squig Hoppers, and his Shadow Warriors reform to flank my General after he over-runs the RBT (assuming he will).

I use all my dice to Dispel his Conflagration of Doom, he gets of Flaming Sword off.

The Lothern Sea Guard kill 3 Night Goblin bowmen in six hits.

Prior to forming up to face the dragon (and showing my one proxy unit...only 2 actual riders)

The dragon tears the Squig Hoppers to shreds, and then pursues leading to one of my favorite moments in recent memory.

Check out the joy on that Squig-hoppers face. He survived the onslaught...will he survive the pursuit?

It also releases all my Fanatics who open up a can of whoop-smurf on his candy smurf. ** They do a whopping 17 hits. 10 on the dragon, doing....ONE wound. ONE. Hence, I will probably need my Giant to do any damage to him... But they do seven wounds to the Mage. He saves 4 but dies, and the Dragon gets the "whimper" result...which means the Fanatic that JUST reached him dies, and in its death throws, he takes another 2 wounds.

Meanwhile, my General kills both Bolt Thrower crew with impact hits, and gets nearly a max over-run, thus escaping the Shadow Warriors.

I kept trying to anticipate his wins and over-runs so I could counter-charge with my Chariot. It never worked...because I kept beating his Elite units with the Savage Orcs.

High Elf Turn 3

His Swordmasters (I think I called them Phoenix Guard earlier) charge my Save Orc Big Uns. I am not too worried...I have a couple ranks, they are my best combat troops, with good S and T and an extra attack from the Choppas and another from Frenzy.

His champ and mine go into a challenge. His General kills one Big Un. In the challenge, I ward save his hit (Go 6+ Ward!) and wound him back 3 times. He saves 2 with his own Ward save but fails the third and dies. The other 3 swordmasters kill 2 Big Uns, my last guy kills 2 of his. I win by 2 but he passes his test.

Orc & Goblin Turn 4

The Giant charges into the combat and gets in a challenge with Cadryan (?). Foot of Gork stomps the Lothern Seaguard, killing 4, I release my bound spell 'headbuttt to kill another, and then the Gaze of Gork finishes them off. Magic FTW!

In the challenge, Cadryan wounds the Giant. The Giant swings his club, wounding Cadryan thrice, but saved twice, so tied. His Sword masters kill 2 Big Uns, I do 2 wounds back and he armor saves one and ward saves the other. I still win the combat...

High Elf Turn 4

He makes a couple charges on my right flank with his tardily moving White Lions and Phoenix Guard.

Note: he had not played for a while, so this was understandable. In our post-battle discussion, these were the primary topic. He admitted his initial plan was thwarted...and as a result he only began moving them late in the game.
This was a big advantage for me as it allowed my weak flank to hold its own and actually (eventually) take out his dragon mage while my strong flank was allowed to have more strength at each point of contact.

There is a lesson here for every general . Units you place or leave where they are no threat are wasted points and give your opponent an unnecessary advantage. He effectively removed nearly a third of his points from the battle until too late whereas I had just about 10% of my points over there.

This had the same effect as giving me over a 300 point advantage...and in a 1500 point game, that is far too much unless one player is VASTLY superior to the other.

Always make sure you have not just a primary role for each troop, but also a secondary role...never let them just stand around. At the very least THREATEN your opponent with them...maybe a flank charge or even a frontal charge if necessary. A threat is often better than an actual attack because your opponent then has to react.

This is not a shot at Space Monkey. I think it would be unfair to expect someone who had not played in close to a year to play a flawless game (and I have already shown that I hardly played a flawless game...) and this is exactly the type of thing that is more about inexperience and rust than anything.

Anyway, I stand and shoot....3 Phoenix Guard slain, the other 2 break and run. The White Lions make it in.

His Shadow Guard also charge my General.

The White Lions only kill 2 bowmen and take a casualty in return. I am ranked (I had reformed a while before when I had no target and I was thinking about moving my spearmen)...he breaks and flees.

My general kills 2 Shadow Warriors, the other breaks, I overrun him.

Cadryan cannot wound the Giant, the Giant again swings club. Three wounds...two saved, one not. It is enough. Cadryan dies...and does 5 wounds to the Giant with the curse, killing him as well!

This was the highlight of the night, as it was the express purpose Space Monkey included Cadryan, and it worked. He wanted Cadryan to die and take someone with him via curse. Since the Giant was my single most expensive model (by about double!) it was the right one.

No damage from the fall.

His Swordmasters die and we call it.

The traditional "We survived the carnage" photo op.

Overview

My Chariot did lots of maneuvering, but never managed to get into combat. Fail. Well, sort of...it was always a threat he had to be aware of. Would have been nice to get some impact hits...and I kept it from getting charged. But still...fail.

My General, by contrast, rampaged around the field killing indiscriminately. He basically Casablanca'd the entire High Elf army.

The Spear chukkas, for just 70 points total, put a wound on a dragon. The fanatics killed the dragon (and about 6 or 7 Night Goblins) and Mage. Epic success.

The Squig Hoppers lured him to where I wanted him...65 points well spent.

The Savage Orc big Uns were fun (and look cool) but struggled to wound t3 troops. Scary. I can only imagine how ugly it would be against Chaos Warriors or Ogres. Oh, well.

The Savage Orc Shaman and Night Goblin Shaman combined to kill 3 Knights, 10 Lothern Sea Guard, and keep him from getting off Conflagration of Doom.

This was a very enjoyable evening with my favorite Warhammer outcome. Do not know who won...do not care. We both did some casualties, both took some, and had a great time with my good friend playing an entertaining game.

Oh, and...the O&G are quite fun.

* Yes, I realize the chariot and Spear Chukkas do not have options for those things...but they were the only models I had to hand to fill the points.
** Yes, you are welcome for the random, pointless callback to the Great One, the Rock. Do you smell what I am cooking?